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Episode 44

Protected Mobility - What Does it Take to be a Professional Security Driver? | Neil Davies OBE

Being a modern professional security driver in the world of executive protection takes a lot more than just knowing how to get your client from point A to B. On today’s podcast we’re going to take a deep dive into this often under-appreciated role to find out what it means to be classified as a legitimate security driver.

If you’re a protector, you know the sense of relief you feel when you turn up to an assignment and realise, you’re working alongside a skilled and professional security driver. But what does it take to get to that standard? 

On today’s show, our guest is Neil Davis OBE, Co-Founder of Secure Ground Transportation, and a long-time veteran of the industry. We’re going to discuss the role of the security driver on EP operations and we’ll also cover…

  • How has protected Mobility evolved, coming out of the pandemic, and what changes have you seen in client vehicle selection?
  • Where will the next generation of security drivers be sourced from and what makes a quality driver as part of an executive protection team?
  • What are the limitations of self-driving vehicles and do they have a place in executive protection?
  • With all the advancements in tech, what is being done to address the threat of espionage and safeguard privacy for principals when on the move?

Neil’s passion for this subject is evident, and as he reminds us: 

“The term security driver and security driving. They’re not marketing buzzwords. That is a statement of training.”

More about Neil:

Neil has been a member of the Institute of Advanced Motorists for over 20 years and holds a 1st which is the highest driving qualification they award. He also holds an iQ (Industry Qualification) Level 4 in Security Driving, Vehicle Management.  This is the highest civilian security driving qualification in the United Kingdom. The course was designed and is run by a former Metropolitan Police Special Escort Group training Sergeant.  Neil is First Aid trained and as one would expect carries a full First Aid Kit and AED in his vehicle at all times. 

Neil has a passion for helping others and giving back to the community.  He recently completed a charity bike ride from Cardiff to Swansea raising money for a cancer hospital in Cardiff. He was a school governor which is a voluntary position and ended up as the National Chairman.  He was appointed an Officer of the Order of the British Empire for his services to Education. 

LinkedIn

Secure Ground Transportation


More about the Circuit:

The Circuit Magazine is written and produced by volunteers, most of who are operationally active, working full time in the security industry. The magazine is a product of their combined passion and desire to give something back to the industry. By subscribing to the magazine you are helping to keep it going into the future. Find out more >

If you liked this podcast, we have an accompanying weekly newsletter called 'On the Circuit' where we take a deeper dive into the wider industry. Opt in here >

The Circuit team is:

  • Elijah Shaw
  • Jon Moss
  • Shaun West
  • Phelim Rowe


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Transcript
Neil Davies OBE:

Some people will see it as possibly a

Neil Davies OBE:

licensed to drive like a lunatic.

Neil Davies OBE:

But when you've got a principal on the board, just imagine you're in

Neil Davies OBE:

Knightsbridge and you were looking along past Harrods and there you've

Neil Davies OBE:

got six range rovers, 5s classes, four seven series, half a dozen V classes.

Neil Davies OBE:

Who's going to be the security drive around to that lot.

Neil Davies OBE:

And you will never know until things go wrong and that security driver's

Neil Davies OBE:

got to flick a switch and then.

Neil Davies OBE:

Hold on.

Neil Davies OBE:

I'm getting you out of here because we've got trouble.

Intro:

welcome to the circuit magazine.

Intro:

The number one source for information on protection matters.

Intro:

The industry leading magazine for all security professionals who

Intro:

want to stay ahead of the game.

Phelim:

Security driving and the EAP professional today, we're going to

Phelim:

be talking with Neil Davis co-founder of secure ground transportation.

Phelim:

Uh, I'm here with Shaun West, Shaun surely this is a topic

Phelim:

that everybody knows about.

Phelim:

Why do we need to do a session on protected mobility?

Shaun:

You would think everyone knows about this, but

Shaun:

that's not always the case.

Shaun:

I mean, security driving.

Shaun:

Just being able to drive a vehicle and having a security background, it

Shaun:

requires skill and knowledge to be able to move the principal for me.

Shaun:

And see if it's a drought and that's across many environments as well.

Shaun:

There's all sorts of that can go into that, you know, route selection, positive

Shaun:

awareness control of high power vehicles.

Shaun:

And you've also got the principal in the car.

Shaun:

So you've got the pressure of the principal being in the car.

Shaun:

If an incident happens off, if there's an accident in front,

Shaun:

there's lots of things you're taking.

Shaun:

By having a good security trend driver on the team and allows the rest

Neil Davies OBE:

of the team to do their jobs correctly

Shaun:

as well, because they know you're focusing on the vehicle.

Shaun:

I'd get that vehicle from point a to B safely.

Phelim:

Absolutely.

Phelim:

Cause I mean, all right, maybe not everyone can afford the luxury if it is

Phelim:

a luxury, but if you are a one person team, you cannot go and park the car

Phelim:

up and then go find the principal.

Phelim:

So somebody has to be there.

Phelim:

The driver has to be separate to the EPA team.

Phelim:

Surely nobody simply hires a security driver and then jumps out.

Phelim:

And then the security driver comes to find them later.

Phelim:

Surely everybody who's minded to employ some security will have an

Phelim:

AP professional and the driver.

Shaun:

No, I think that's not always the case, but a lot of it comes

Shaun:

down to budgets and, and threat profiles who the principal is.

Shaun:

Know, some of them may want to be located.

Shaun:

They just want to drive to get them from point a to point B safely and securely.

Shaun:

Um, where, if you're an individual who has a lot of time in the public

Shaun:

eye, your security would be uplifted.

Shaun:

You know, maybe you have a security driver or a driver unsecurity, each

Shaun:

task is unique and yeah, 90%, 99% of the time it will come down to budget.

Phelim:

Okay.

Phelim:

And then why.

Phelim:

Is everyone not driving around in a B6 B seven armored vehicle?

Phelim:

Surely that's a sure-fire way of being more secure, um,

Phelim:

or is this country specific?

Phelim:

I think it

Shaun:

is country specific.

Shaun:

And also there's if, say for instance, if you're driving home in

Shaun:

the year, If there's no high threats on your principle, then why would

Shaun:

you need a normal vehicle having some form of, you know, big vehicle?

Shaun:

Like if your presence on the road see a range, for instance, you know,

Shaun:

you're nice and secure in the cup.

Shaun:

Ideally there's no courage of firearms in the UK legally.

Shaun:

Um, whereas if you were flying out, if you're working out in

Shaun:

Syria, Iraq, Afghanistan, you have to be a lot more requirement

Shaun:

for having an all orbit type of.

Shaun:

For transporting principles, depending on how you're operating, whether

Shaun:

you're operating high-profile or you're going more covert new field

Shaun:

of operations, I guess each same.

Shaun:

Again, each situation client is unique and it's different requirements

Phelim:

that would basically resonate with a lot of, uh, ex service personnel.

Phelim:

You know, if you do go up to a sensitive situation in some sort of M rap, you

Phelim:

kind of get a different response from if you went in a soft top very carefully,

Phelim:

or maybe you even took a local taxi, it depends on how you want to blend

Phelim:

in or how you don't want to blend in.

Shaun:

Yeah, for sure.

Shaun:

And the maneuverability of an armored vehicle.

Shaun:

The cm has a vehicle that is not in all my vehicle.

Shaun:

Um, so legacy, I think for each job task that's out there, I guess at

Shaun:

the start of the task, there will be some sort of threat assessment and

Shaun:

there'll be a decision made by whoever there is a director of security.

Shaun:

Whoever's holding the purse strings on what the requirements are to

Shaun:

provide the best security to, and

Phelim:

our, you know, circuit magazine audience is probably thinking,

Phelim:

yeah, I know all this because I deal with security drivers, um, you

Phelim:

know, every day and yet it's often not where we would like it to be.

Phelim:

So we've got, uh, the Glasgow summit finishing up, uh, this week, next

Phelim:

week, we've got lots of interests.

Phelim:

Things coming up and interesting assignments.

Phelim:

Why should we be getting our community to pay more attention to the value

Phelim:

of a bonafide security driver in, in place of an AP professional,

Phelim:

thinking that they'll wing it?

Shaun:

I think there's a lot of value in if you're making a transition

Shaun:

from your, your day job as a CPO or executive protection professional,

Shaun:

I've always been of the mindset.

Shaun:

Well, whatever I'm working on, I'll throw myself fully into that role.

Shaun:

You all develop myself, I'll carry out trading.

Shaun:

I learn everything that I can to deliver that role to the best of my ability.

Shaun:

And with, as I was saying, every individual is very different.

Shaun:

If you're in a job.

Shaun:

You know, you're getting paid every month, every week, whatever, it may be.

Shaun:

Some people are happy with us.

Shaun:

They come to work at nine o'clock.

Shaun:

They go home at five and then they switch off where you'll have individuals, that

Shaun:

their profession is also a passion.

Shaun:

You know, when you want to Excel in what you do.

Shaun:

And I think if you are an executive protection professional, by throwing

Shaun:

your, if you're looking to transition into being a security driver,

Shaun:

there's lots of training out there.

Shaun:

And if you carry out that training and you set yourself above everybody

Shaun:

else, you're gonna put yourself in a lot better position moving forward.

Shaun:

You know, to get on one of these teams as a security driver, because

Shaun:

you'll have a lot more qualifications.

Shaun:

And, you know, if you get checked out for a trial road in the vehicle,

Shaun:

you'll have that inbred in-depth knowledge, which you can talk about a.

Shaun:

It

Phelim:

will.

Phelim:

And let's then hear from, uh, Neil Davis himself, uh, obviously a

Phelim:

longstanding friend of us and the industry and someone that has in fact

Phelim:

also spoken on our protected mobility forum that we ran earlier this year.

Phelim:

Very much looking forward to this Neil Davis secure rounds, transportation.

Intro:

and now let's meet one of the contributors

Intro:

to the circuit magazine.

Phelim:

Looking under the hood of protected mobility.

Phelim:

We're here with Neil Davis, co-founder of secure ground transportation

Phelim:

at Shawn west and myself.

Phelim:

We're very pleased to have you on how are you doing

Neil Davies OBE:

fine.

Neil Davies OBE:

Thank you.

Neil Davies OBE:

Thanks for inviting me.

Phelim:

Absolute pleasure.

Phelim:

Absolute pleasure.

Phelim:

Well, especially.

Phelim:

Uh, you know, the topic of vehicles, mobility protecting the principle.

Phelim:

It seems core to everyone's day job in the EAP world.

Phelim:

But what would you say is the sort of problem at the moment with

Phelim:

protecting mobility that perhaps you're, you're trying to solve?

Phelim:

So

Neil Davies OBE:

there's, there's two points here.

Neil Davies OBE:

There's there's one, the principal who wants EAP.

Neil Davies OBE:

But however, doesn't see the need to do it properly in the protective

Neil Davies OBE:

worlds role or through their eyes.

Neil Davies OBE:

And by that, I mean, you know, you can do one job at a time.

Neil Davies OBE:

I know we all multitask, you know, we're juggling balls.

Neil Davies OBE:

However, when it comes to protecting people, you know,

Neil Davies OBE:

you're either EAP out on foot.

Neil Davies OBE:

Once you debus the vehicle or you're, or your.

Neil Davies OBE:

You're a security driver, the two roles you can't do together.

Neil Davies OBE:

So trying to get that across to a principal that, you

Neil Davies OBE:

know, like, I want security.

Neil Davies OBE:

Okay.

Neil Davies OBE:

You can have your security and you needed me to security driver.

Neil Davies OBE:

So, so that's, that's the one thing.

Neil Davies OBE:

The principal doesn't always see that there is, uh, a different role

Neil Davies OBE:

to be played by both, both people.

Neil Davies OBE:

The other one is people in the security industry actually, who try to do.

Neil Davies OBE:

As one person.

Neil Davies OBE:

And, and to my mind, I think they're letting the, letting the team down because

Neil Davies OBE:

what we should be doing is we should be educating the principal on how to reduce

Neil Davies OBE:

the risk as much as humanly possible.

Neil Davies OBE:

And if you're not doing that, then you're missing a trick and you're

Neil Davies OBE:

actually leaving yourself wide open.

Neil Davies OBE:

So just take the scenario.

Neil Davies OBE:

You know, there are a number of places in London that are.

Neil Davies OBE:

And the principal sees something and they want to get out.

Neil Davies OBE:

And this happened, they want to get out of the vehicle now, but by the

Neil Davies OBE:

time you go and park up, because you know, you stopped in traffic,

Neil Davies OBE:

they fling the door open there.

Neil Davies OBE:

But the time you parked up and tried to find the principal, the

Neil Davies OBE:

damage could have already been

Phelim:

that's a stock picture.

Phelim:

And actually that red road example, that's, that's, that's probably

Phelim:

quite common, unfortunately, but let's take a step back.

Phelim:

Um, obviously you, you know, you, you, you're a great friend of the industry and,

Phelim:

uh, the association and, uh, you know, the magazine of course, You in particular,

Phelim:

where does your passion for this topic?

Phelim:

Uh, so

Neil Davies OBE:

take me back, take me back quite a number of years.

Neil Davies OBE:

I've been a member of the Institute of advanced Mobius.

Neil Davies OBE:

Now for 23 years, I was very fortunate enough to be honored by him.

Neil Davies OBE:

I just do the cream for services.

Neil Davies OBE:

Not to the security industry.

Neil Davies OBE:

So I was the national chairman of school governors, or for people who

Neil Davies OBE:

might be listening from America.

Neil Davies OBE:

I was the national chairman of school boards.

Neil Davies OBE:

And while I was doing that, I was invited by Vladimir Putin to go out and advise

Neil Davies OBE:

his administerial team out in Russia, on introducing school boards to Russia.

Neil Davies OBE:

And it opened my eyes up to the way that things worked,

Neil Davies OBE:

because he provided me with.

Neil Davies OBE:

Um, a security drive and a bodyguard because I was his guest.

Neil Davies OBE:

He didn't want anything to happen to me.

Neil Davies OBE:

Or do you want me to keep an eye on what I was doing one or the other?

Neil Davies OBE:

Um, I'm I saw a different side to the industry and, and to what was going on.

Neil Davies OBE:

And then when I looked around it at what was happening in the UK with regards to.

Neil Davies OBE:

Logins and crying and make cetera, et cetera.

Neil Davies OBE:

I just saw that there was a need for, you know, the industry, especially the

Neil Davies OBE:

chauffeur industry to up their game.

Neil Davies OBE:

Not everybody wants to do it.

Neil Davies OBE:

That's fine because it means there's more work for us, but it just allowed me to

Neil Davies OBE:

explore the different avenues and then go out and get the training that we've done.

Neil Davies OBE:

That is

Phelim:

quite a unique backstory, but I, but I, but I'm really glad

Phelim:

you shared that with us, because that really brings to light.

Phelim:

You've been on both sides of the fence, which is really key.

Phelim:

But as always, we have our third quick bio question, which is,

Phelim:

you know, what would you like?

Phelim:

The people that know absolutely nothing about secure ground transportation

Phelim:

or protected mobility to better know.

Phelim:

And I'm going to include in that group, the people that think they know, but

Phelim:

done.

Neil Davies OBE:

Uh, the first thing I would say, you know, we're in the age

Neil Davies OBE:

of social media, where lots of stuff gets bandied about, you know, the term

Neil Davies OBE:

security driver and security driving.

Neil Davies OBE:

That's not a marketing buzzword.

Neil Davies OBE:

That is a statement of training.

Neil Davies OBE:

And if we can get that across to people, then I think, you know, w we're

Neil Davies OBE:

halfway to win in the battle because the training, I mean, I underwent, uh, uh,

Neil Davies OBE:

Intensive residential course training in the UK, trained by a Sergeant who

Neil Davies OBE:

was a special escort group trainer.

Neil Davies OBE:

Um, and he was also a Sergeant in charge of a team.

Neil Davies OBE:

There were two sergeants that trained us.

Neil Davies OBE:

So that's on the driving side.

Neil Davies OBE:

But then on the other side of things, you know, all of our security, chauffeurs

Neil Davies OBE:

security drivers were all first aid trained a full trauma kit in the car.

Neil Davies OBE:

Um, carry an AED in the.

Neil Davies OBE:

And we know how to use them.

Neil Davies OBE:

There's a lot of people out there who've got kit that

Neil Davies OBE:

don't don't know how to use it.

Neil Davies OBE:

Probably don't go and refreshes.

Neil Davies OBE:

So, you know, I think this.

Neil Davies OBE:

As the buzzword is 11 and up bringing the standard up in the industry and getting

Neil Davies OBE:

that out to cross the people that, you know, when you employ a professional

Neil Davies OBE:

security driver or a professional executive protection person, male or

Neil Davies OBE:

female, you've got somebody that actually has gone through the training and, you

Neil Davies OBE:

know, does what it says on the tin.

Shaun:

So Neil, good and buck, obviously we've just come out of a pandemic.

Shaun:

How do you find in the last sort of 18 months, two years I was

Shaun:

protected, protected Mobility evolve.

Shaun:

And what vehicles are becoming more popular?

Shaun:

Do you find,

Neil Davies OBE:

um, whole vehicles nowadays?

Neil Davies OBE:

There's a good question.

Neil Davies OBE:

So, um, over the last 18 months, uh, you know, a lot of art, a lot of

Neil Davies OBE:

our work is inbound from the states.

Neil Davies OBE:

Um, as well as Japan, um, Obviously there was very little travel internationally.

Neil Davies OBE:

Uh, as we know, there was some, um, and, uh, you know, we handled it, uh,

Neil Davies OBE:

and now we are like, I would say we're not maybe 5% back to where we were.

Neil Davies OBE:

We were 110% back to where we were.

Neil Davies OBE:

We seem to be flat out all the time at the moment short.

Neil Davies OBE:

So.

Neil Davies OBE:

It was good because it gave us time to reflect.

Neil Davies OBE:

It gave me time to get fitter.

Neil Davies OBE:

You know, I've been out, I've lost 15 kilos.

Neil Davies OBE:

Um, I'm, I'm happy with that.

Neil Davies OBE:

Um, it gave us time to look at the business and how we could develop

Neil Davies OBE:

it and move it forward, perhaps.

Neil Davies OBE:

Uh, we'll just have to revamp the website that tells people

Neil Davies OBE:

more than the old one did.

Neil Davies OBE:

Uh, we've got training courses planned, et cetera, et cetera.

Neil Davies OBE:

When you look at vehicles, um, a lot of people like to be in an

Neil Davies OBE:

S class because of the comfort Mercedes-Benz word, doing a reasonable.

Neil Davies OBE:

With regards to leasing vehicles.

Neil Davies OBE:

Um, they've just upped.

Neil Davies OBE:

There's no discount on new vehicles anymore.

Neil Davies OBE:

You know, there's this huge global shortage of chips.

Neil Davies OBE:

So the, the pool of brand new vehicles is smaller and smaller.

Neil Davies OBE:

The second on market has gone through the roof.

Neil Davies OBE:

You know, people are getting more now than they paid for a car in 2020,

Neil Davies OBE:

um, popular vehicles for our type of work, tend to be range, right.

Neil Davies OBE:

Um, S class, all a V class, depending on how many people you've got in a follow

Neil Davies OBE:

vehicle, you know, if you've got one person named with the principal, then

Neil Davies OBE:

it's either an x-ray or a range Rover.

Neil Davies OBE:

Um, and then your backup vehicle with perhaps another two or three, um,

Neil Davies OBE:

protection values in it, or girls, ladies, or gentlemen, um, might be

Neil Davies OBE:

a vehicle for purely and simply for.

Neil Davies OBE:

Getting in and out quickly.

Shaun:

Yeah, that's pretty sure not to my main feed that we use at the

Shaun:

moment as class for the principal or near back when the main principal

Shaun:

comes in and we have the backing range.

Shaun:

All of us, we have the Viano's for all of the hangers on the wider team

Shaun:

of the principal, the inner circle.

Shaun:

Yep.

Shaun:

So to talk in all my vehicles and why would you consider

Shaun:

a normal vehicle preferable?

Shaun:

Less conspicuous at the board with all my vehicles in the

Neil Davies OBE:

UK.

Neil Davies OBE:

I wouldn't consider an armored vehicle.

Neil Davies OBE:

There's no need for it in the UK, no need for a toll.

Neil Davies OBE:

You know, we all know everybody listening knows the only people that are legally

Neil Davies OBE:

allowed to carry firearms in the United Kingdom are the police and the military.

Neil Davies OBE:

Yeah.

Neil Davies OBE:

Um, for want of a better word, Rollins who might get themselves

Neil Davies OBE:

involved with firearms, but that is normally gang related crime.

Neil Davies OBE:

Um, and it's nothing to do with looking after and the

Neil Davies OBE:

principles that we transport.

Neil Davies OBE:

So armor.

Neil Davies OBE:

Very few and far between there are some around in the UK.

Neil Davies OBE:

Um, we tend not to have a request for them.

Neil Davies OBE:

And you know, when we do, we go about, on network to see if, if

Shaun:

there's availability.

Shaun:

So always find interesting.

Shaun:

You know, when we look at the SIU in the UK and the other, all the

Shaun:

different licenses for different professions, close protection license,

Shaun:

they don't supervisor license.

Shaun:

Uh, security tree drive driver.

Shaun:

There's no almost formalized credentials or qualification.

Shaun:

It could be anyone who comes from ex-military background.

Shaun:

You drive a car and then it's almost, you can fly the flag

Shaun:

and say, I am a security driver.

Shaun:

you know, I don't think there's a lot of education or the principals on.

Shaun:

To what a real security driver is, the benefits of know

Shaun:

what they bring to the table.

Shaun:

Um, but she keeps drawing us.

Shaun:

Where do you think the next generation of security drivers should be sourced from?

Shaun:

And what makes a quality driver as part of an executive

Neil Davies OBE:

protection team

Neil Davies OBE:

called?

Neil Davies OBE:

It was all born.

Neil Davies OBE:

They're made pure and simple.

Neil Davies OBE:

You know, you it's repetition, repetition, repetition, you know, you, you need to.

Neil Davies OBE:

Drivers you work so that, what do I mean by that?

Neil Davies OBE:

Well, the training that you do needs to be replicated as close as

Neil Davies OBE:

possible to the way that you work.

Neil Davies OBE:

However, you need some tools in your, in your toolkit and if you

Neil Davies OBE:

need to get out of trouble, you can.

Neil Davies OBE:

Yup.

Neil Davies OBE:

Um, next generation, it really depends.

Neil Davies OBE:

I think, you know, that's a tricky one, Sean, because some people see.

Neil Davies OBE:

As improving their driving skills, um, by taking a formally recognized

Neil Davies OBE:

course, lead into a qualification.

Neil Davies OBE:

Um, some people see it as, um, possibly a license to drive like a lunatic,

Neil Davies OBE:

but when you've got a principal on board, just imagine, just imagine

Neil Davies OBE:

you're in Knightsbridge and you were looking along past Harrods and

Neil Davies OBE:

there you've got six range Rover.

Neil Davies OBE:

5s classes for seven series, half a dozen V classes.

Neil Davies OBE:

Who's going to be the security driver, open that lot, and you will

Neil Davies OBE:

never know until things go wrong.

Neil Davies OBE:

And that security driver's got to flick a switch and go, hold

Neil Davies OBE:

on, I'm getting your right.

Neil Davies OBE:

Because we've got trouble.

Neil Davies OBE:

So, you know, quiet efficiency is the hallmark of a true professional when

Neil Davies OBE:

it comes to, to EAP driving or any other industry, you know, you just go

Neil Davies OBE:

about your business quietly, don't draw attention to yourself, just do your job

Neil Davies OBE:

and, and keep everything under control.

Neil Davies OBE:

And there are some people out there that do that really, really.

Neil Davies OBE:

But there are some people in the driving world that think that because

Neil Davies OBE:

they come from a certain background and they can do it and they can't

Neil Davies OBE:

because they haven't practiced it.

Neil Davies OBE:

They don't go and refreshes.

Neil Davies OBE:

They haven't practiced it for ages.

Neil Davies OBE:

They might get into a vehicle that they're not familiar with.

Neil Davies OBE:

You know, they don't, they don't know where all the controls are.

Neil Davies OBE:

A classic example.

Neil Davies OBE:

I was asked to train somebody, who's the chauffeur to the managing

Neil Davies OBE:

director of a large company.

Neil Davies OBE:

So I was asked if I could do.

Neil Davies OBE:

And this guy, um, been in, been a chauffer for 35 years.

Neil Davies OBE:

So I thought, okay, fair enough.

Neil Davies OBE:

It should be all right.

Neil Davies OBE:

Didn't want to let him put him into a vehicle he wasn't familiar with.

Neil Davies OBE:

Um, let him get on with them.

Neil Davies OBE:

You set the seat up, but then when it came to our dunno, 40 minutes into

Neil Davies OBE:

the end of the journey, um, giving him instruction and explained it to him,

Neil Davies OBE:

what I expected to learn him to learn and what I was going to teach him.

Neil Davies OBE:

He was asking me where the controls were.

Neil Davies OBE:

So, you know, you can't have a security driver jumping into a vehicle

Neil Davies OBE:

that they're not familiar with.

Neil Davies OBE:

And sadly, I see it happen all time.

Neil Davies OBE:

People would go and hire a call from Amos Hertz.

Neil Davies OBE:

You know, somebody who is SIA.

Neil Davies OBE:

The jump in a vehicle.

Neil Davies OBE:

I haven't driven it for a year.

Neil Davies OBE:

It's a new model done the way the controls are.

Neil Davies OBE:

Don't get shown where the controls are and then when things go wrong and they

Neil Davies OBE:

haven't driven that vehicle, they don't know how it control how it's controlled.

Neil Davies OBE:

They don't know how it reacts under stress and that severe in under maneuvers

Neil Davies OBE:

that's when things go wrong and you can't afford in our industry to have that.

Neil Davies OBE:

Because you lose your reputation, you lose

Shaun:

your business.

Shaun:

No, you're totally right.

Shaun:

I mean, if you're employed as a security driver, you need to

Shaun:

know your vehicle inside out.

Shaun:

And of course you may be asked to change your vehicles, but you should have a

Shaun:

knowledge of high powered vehicles.

Shaun:

You don't have to control them safely and get your principal from

Shaun:

a, to B in a safe and secure manner.

Shaun:

You're right.

Shaun:

What you're sitting as well.

Shaun:

You know, when we were talking about what makes a quality driver.

Shaun:

We was talking about before on different podcasts, you know, Skillfeed unless

Shaun:

you're carrying out and doing refresher training in that area, there's a

Shaun:

lot of skill feed involved in that capacity and she, you do, you need to

Shaun:

continually refresh your skills and, you know, be all over your vehicle.

Neil Davies OBE:

But anyway,

Shaun:

with vehicles now you've seen lots of talk about self-driving.

Shaun:

If there's any place for that?

Shaun:

what's your thoughts on them and the limitations of the self-driving vehicles?

Neil Davies OBE:

Uh, the F the first self driving vehicle I saw was out

Neil Davies OBE:

in San Francisco when, uh, I was out there meeting a client last year.

Neil Davies OBE:

Uh, yeah, last beginning, last year.

Neil Davies OBE:

Uh, I looked at it and thought it was a spaceship on wheels.

Neil Davies OBE:

You know, all these F every corner I had these gadgets on it.

Neil Davies OBE:

Every bumper had the gadgets on it.

Neil Davies OBE:

I looked at it.

Neil Davies OBE:

I would want to pull up outside the Dorchester in one of them,

Neil Davies OBE:

you know, it's like, look at me.

Neil Davies OBE:

Um, I don't think, I don't think we're going to get rid of them because.

Neil Davies OBE:

You know, the three of us on this podcast or of a certain generation.

Neil Davies OBE:

Um, but the young stares of today are all about tech and the latest

Neil Davies OBE:

gizmo and gadget, you know, a classic example of that is, you

Neil Davies OBE:

know, like how many times an iPhone.

Neil Davies OBE:

And look how many they sell.

Neil Davies OBE:

Are you telling me that from the last one to this one, there are that many

Neil Davies OBE:

people that haven't got an iPhone that go out and buy them in their millions.

Neil Davies OBE:

No, they want the latest.

Neil Davies OBE:

So I think the younger generation will want the Teslas and the, you know,

Neil Davies OBE:

the, the battery powered cars that perhaps won't get you up at night.

Neil Davies OBE:

Um, and they're quite happy to stop.

Neil Davies OBE:

Um, and I think that generation as well will be equally as happy

Neil Davies OBE:

to be in a self-driving vehicle.

Neil Davies OBE:

Somebody like myself doing the job that we're doing.

Neil Davies OBE:

No, not at all.

Neil Davies OBE:

Not at all need to be in full control of the vehicle.

Phelim:

And Neil.

Phelim:

That's what the, uh, the word on the street has been, that maybe you won't be

Phelim:

in full control and it doesn't have to be a futuristic self-driving vehicle, even

Phelim:

if we allowed them on smart motorways.

Phelim:

Um, what about vehicles that at the moment have collision avoidance system?

Phelim:

What about vehicles that at the moment can take your control away from you?

Phelim:

Um, you know, you, you say that in the UK, we don't have too much cold for almond

Phelim:

vehicle space, 67 or something like that.

Phelim:

Right.

Phelim:

But, and this fence, for example, Given to me by some Americans, admittedly,

Phelim:

Americans has a bit of an environment.

Phelim:

Um, what if you stood in front of a Tesla and behind a Tesla,

Phelim:

the Tesla will be immobilized.

Phelim:

Uh, it won't go anywhere.

Phelim:

And if you had, uh, some fire, um, and, and you hadn't.

Phelim:

Then maybe a problem could ensue.

Phelim:

Um, what are your thoughts there?

Phelim:

Because there's a big difference between a fully space ship ESC, a

Phelim:

self-driving vehicle, and one that can take control away from you.

Neil Davies OBE:

It goes back to this stuff that Joe talked about when, um,

Neil Davies OBE:

when he was on, um, the last time that we were talking, um, and that is, you

Neil Davies OBE:

know, being able to switch stuff up.

Neil Davies OBE:

You know, it's great to having these vehicles, they do everything for you.

Neil Davies OBE:

However, in our industry, you need to be able to limit what it does

Neil Davies OBE:

because the example you give is the best example I've heard of.

Neil Davies OBE:

Somebody stands in front of somebody stands behind, where are you going to go?

Neil Davies OBE:

Cause the car's not going to move, you know?

Neil Davies OBE:

And all of a sudden you've got.

Neil Davies OBE:

You got a dead security driver and you got a dead principle or at least the dead

Neil Davies OBE:

principle, if that's what they're after.

Neil Davies OBE:

So you need to have, have the choice, the option to turn these

Neil Davies OBE:

facilities off on some vehicles.

Neil Davies OBE:

I think only ODH you can do it.

Neil Davies OBE:

I'm driven at ODA eight for ages, but I think you could turn, there was, there

Neil Davies OBE:

was like a collision avoidance thing.

Neil Davies OBE:

Um, and you could turn that off.

Neil Davies OBE:

Um, if you, if you needed to, whether that's the case now or not.

Neil Davies OBE:

I do not know cause I haven't driven one for a number of years.

Phelim:

And then maybe following on from that, you know, some, some

Phelim:

people have said, well, privacy is a really key consideration.

Phelim:

And with the private jets, they, they quickly cottoned on to turning

Phelim:

off the call, sign on that very popular website that everyone, you

Phelim:

know, watches, planes go in and out, you know, limiting information.

Phelim:

Um, All we at all worried about the on March of telematics and the

Phelim:

on March of data in the vehicle.

Phelim:

Cause, um, principals are, are very sensitive to, uh,

Phelim:

industrial espionage, right?

Phelim:

Uh, how, how, how attuned or worried should the driving committees.

Neil Davies OBE:

Well, first things first, when, when somebody gets into a

Neil Davies OBE:

vehicle and they plug this there, their phone name to the USB to charge it.

Neil Davies OBE:

The one thing you don't do is download your contact details, period.

Neil Davies OBE:

You don't, you don't allow the vehicle access because as soon

Neil Davies OBE:

as you do, um, I, you hand that vehicle over to somebody else.

Neil Davies OBE:

They've got your address, book simple, you know, how many people jump into

Neil Davies OBE:

a hired vehicle or any other day?

Neil Davies OBE:

Plug their phone in lead the contacts Bosch

Shaun:

and they're

Phelim:

all in the vehicle.

Phelim:

Yeah, it doesn't, it doesn't have to be a high-end industrial espionage.

Phelim:

Does it?

Phelim:

It can just kind of say sink.

Neil Davies OBE:

Um, I don't think we've got to this stage in the UK

Neil Davies OBE:

where, you know, we have, um, signal jammers, blockers and stuff like that.

Neil Davies OBE:

Um, we've moved as a company.

Neil Davies OBE:

We've moved some very out.

Neil Davies OBE:

Everybody says, you know, let's go high net with I'm talking ultra high net worth.

Neil Davies OBE:

Ultra ultra high net worth.

Neil Davies OBE:

They've never asked for signal geometers blockers or anything of the sort.

Neil Davies OBE:

Um, but they do it properly.

Neil Davies OBE:

Um, and you know, a team will run.

Neil Davies OBE:

And you with them for a day or two beforehand, and you go out

Neil Davies OBE:

and you do your records properly.

Neil Davies OBE:

That's the way it should be done.

Neil Davies OBE:

Not somebody lands on a jet.

Neil Davies OBE:

I need a security driver and I need, I need protection.

Neil Davies OBE:

And we're, I'm not telling you where I'm going until I land and I get in

Neil Davies OBE:

the vehicle and then I want to go here and it's like, oh, wait a minute.

Neil Davies OBE:

We haven't been down that road for the last three weeks.

Neil Davies OBE:

I wonder if there's any language, what would assume.

Neil Davies OBE:

Because they've not given you the details.

Neil Davies OBE:

And then also people out there that value their privacy so much that

Neil Davies OBE:

that's their, their way of, of working.

Neil Davies OBE:

They tell you when they get into the vehicle, they don't understand our role

Neil Davies OBE:

goes back to the top of this podcast.

Neil Davies OBE:

You know, people understanding what we do, um, as security drivers

Neil Davies OBE:

and what we do as a security.

Neil Davies OBE:

What

Phelim:

should people be aware of coming up?

Phelim:

Obviously, there are some big events at the moment.

Phelim:

We've got the Glasgow summit, uh, going on, um, what big events, particularly

Phelim:

in the UK, just because I suppose, you know, you, you, you can speak to that.

Phelim:

W w where perhaps we're going to really feel the pinch.

Phelim:

If we don't have a security driver,

Neil Davies OBE:

it depends on what line of work you're in.

Neil Davies OBE:

Any businessmen coming in for a large conference where, whether

Neil Davies OBE:

they're an attendee or, or, or a keynote speaker, um, they would

Neil Davies OBE:

need, um, somebody that perhaps has.

Neil Davies OBE:

Going to business that upset friends of the earth, all animal lovers, et cetera.

Neil Davies OBE:

Um, they would need, any face from the, uh, filming on stage, you know, filming

Neil Davies OBE:

screen that perhaps is going to go.

Neil Davies OBE:

Into an area where they could get mobbed.

Neil Davies OBE:

Not only would they need a security driver to safely set them down somewhere,

Neil Davies OBE:

but they'd also need people with them.

Neil Davies OBE:

They'd need executive protection as part of a team.

Neil Davies OBE:

And some people, you know, some people don't want protection.

Neil Davies OBE:

They, they want a security driver.

Neil Davies OBE:

Who knows what to do with this vehicle, how to get out of trouble, how to

Neil Davies OBE:

drive safely, smoothly, and swiftly to the conditions and the speed limits

Neil Davies OBE:

who will then set them down quietly, where they need to go to park up and

Neil Davies OBE:

just blend in with other chauffeurs.

Phelim:

And then on that, that, that blending in.

Phelim:

Uh, skillset and one that perhaps people, you know, doing covert surveillance,

Phelim:

operations would be familiar with, but in the same, in the same sort of

Phelim:

thing, what if you're an AP professional out there thinking, you know what?

Phelim:

I want to make the jump I want to specialize.

Phelim:

Um, what should they do?

Phelim:

You know, is it a common occurrence?

Phelim:

Is the crossover common?

Phelim:

I, I don't even know.

Phelim:

I'm just, I'm just thinking what our community might want.

Neil Davies OBE:

The awesome people.

Neil Davies OBE:

Uh, an example.

Neil Davies OBE:

Okay.

Neil Davies OBE:

Uh, on the training course I did.

Neil Davies OBE:

There was somebody that was, um, excellent protection with a mat.

Neil Davies OBE:

He, um, he spent a lot of time with the majesty, um, and was up in Balmoral

Neil Davies OBE:

a lot as part of the team up there.

Neil Davies OBE:

Um, and he wanted to do the D the security driving course.

Neil Davies OBE:

And no, you would afford.

Neil Davies OBE:

If we got some, we've got somebody here from wild protection, that's his job.

Neil Davies OBE:

And he's learning how to handle a vehicle under pressure.

Neil Davies OBE:

So, you know, there are people out there that are involved in, in the

Neil Davies OBE:

security world that recognize that.

Neil Davies OBE:

What we do is a totally different skillset to what they do, whether

Neil Davies OBE:

it be covert or overt security.

Neil Davies OBE:

Um, another one, uh, that was on the course with us, um,

Neil Davies OBE:

ex military, uh, army chap.

Neil Davies OBE:

Um, he did the driving course with us, bumped into him in

Neil Davies OBE:

Winchester a little while back.

Neil Davies OBE:

Um, he was working for a private time.

Neil Davies OBE:

They wouldn't, they wouldn't, um, work the way that they were supposed to.

Neil Davies OBE:

They were asking him to take shortcuts, which was in danger and the principal,

Neil Davies OBE:

which then would have ended up with him being in hot water, because he was with

Neil Davies OBE:

a team that had a diplomatic immunity and they were going through red lights.

Neil Davies OBE:

They were breaking speed limits.

Neil Davies OBE:

And going through cameras, you said, look, I've got a driving license.

Neil Davies OBE:

I need to protect.

Neil Davies OBE:

Otherwise, I call them work.

Neil Davies OBE:

Um, uh, but you know, so there's somebody who's already from a security

Neil Davies OBE:

background training to come across to our site doesn't happen all the time,

Neil Davies OBE:

but it does happen from time to time.

Shaun:

question.

Shaun:

I think, I think I find that there is a lot of people that switch

Shaun:

over to the security drivers side.

Shaun:

It tends to be people who are getting on in their career.

Shaun:

I find you're getting a little bit.

Shaun:

They were thinking they want to be out on the grounds, being at PG working all hours

Shaun:

and the kind of someone moved into an aura state type role or security driving

Shaun:

is a lot of people going into that area.

Shaun:

Cause they love getting a lot of experience over the

Shaun:

years, carrying out their job.

Neil Davies OBE:

So it's just a, just a quick question.

Neil Davies OBE:

I.

Neil Davies OBE:

They transitioned across, then they go through any formal training.

Neil Davies OBE:

I,

Shaun:

yeah, I do find

Shaun:

some people do look to do training, but you also,

Shaun:

as I mentioned earlier on, there's no licensing, there's no prerequisites.

Shaun:

And you find a lot of people who are, it may be ex-military or it may

Shaun:

be people that work in the security industry for 10, 15, 20 years.

Shaun:

And I want to drive.

Shaun:

And then all of a sudden they have the hot, I'm a security driver and they may

Shaun:

not have done any additional training.

Shaun:

Um, but that's, that's I guess the danger and where we're at at

Shaun:

the moment, there is no licensing.

Shaun:

But.

Shaun:

I think it all depends on the individual.

Shaun:

You know, you got people who are hugely professional and want to Excel

Shaun:

in everything they do, you know?

Shaun:

So they'll continuously develop themselves in the area that they're working on.

Shaun:

You you'll find people who, you know, they get a job and they're happy because

Shaun:

they're getting the bills and they don't want to invest in themselves.

Shaun:

You'll just take the money and carry out their role.

Shaun:

And I think it's each to the owner it's specific to each individual.

Phelim:

Which is perhaps the point of this podcast because each individual

Phelim:

in the IPI community could be a medic, could be, uh, a paramedic, obviously.

Phelim:

Um, we had some comments, so of course that there is a massive difference.

Phelim:

Um, w w it could be eight drive.

Phelim:

It could be a security.

Phelim:

Each to their own, but inside this broad collection, we seek to, uh, to

Phelim:

enlighten the circuit magazine, uh, community Neil, I personally look

Phelim:

forward to seeing you very soon.

Phelim:

In fact, in London, I know you're at the CP world conference.

Phelim:

I will be there.

Phelim:

We're exhibiting.

Phelim:

So we're very much looking forward to seeing you.

Phelim:

Um, and, uh, and yes, I think this is fantastic.

Phelim:

We're going to have to revisit it when the self-driving cars

Phelim:

are a little bit further along.

Phelim:

Um, but, uh, but this has been fantastic.

Phelim:

Um, Neil from Sean and myself.

Phelim:

Thank you very much for being such a great guest on the circuit

Phelim:

magazine podcast, gentlemen,

Neil Davies OBE:

sanctuary

Intro:

vitamin

Phelim:

It was great to look under the hood.

Phelim:

Sorry.

Phelim:

I had to, I had to do it at protected mobility and, and obviously Neil Davis,

Phelim:

uh, spoken before at our protective mobility event earlier this year,

Phelim:

but it was really nice to see him.

Phelim:

Um, Sean, what, what, what did you take away from today's session?

Shaun:

It was very in line with my thoughts.

Shaun:

I agreed with everything he said.

Shaun:

It's, you know, it's a serious profession I think, and people

Shaun:

should take it seriously.

Shaun:

It's not anybody can drive a car, but to be a security driver and

Shaun:

call yourself a security driver.

Shaun:

And I think, you know, you really need to build that.

Shaun:

I've maintained.

Shaun:

Good control of the vehicle, have knowledge of your vehicle and

Phelim:

indeed that craft and always be willing to work on it.

Phelim:

Um, because you might've been doing it 30 years.

Phelim:

There's always something new to know new tech.

Phelim:

Yeah.

Phelim:

Even if part of your job is a bit of a concierge service, knowing the new

Phelim:

places, the new threats, the new bars it's always to be updated and whether

Phelim:

or not we have people crossing over, uh, is, is, is as another point.

Phelim:

And whether or not people can do it all themselves as some sort of

Phelim:

super EAP professional on their own.

Phelim:

I know we said it was because of budget, but I think Neil said,

Phelim:

you know, it's not desirable.

Phelim:

Um, But I'm really looking forward to it.

Phelim:

And I'm going to see Neil at the, uh, CP world event, uh, on Saturday at

Phelim:

the victory services club where we, as the circuit magazine have a stand.

Phelim:

So very much looking forward to seeing everyone there that Saturday,

Phelim:

the 13th of November in London.

Phelim:

And, uh, and, and please do stop by, uh, putting faces to the name and name

Phelim:

to the faces will be very, very useful.

Phelim:

What else have we got coming up short?

Shaun:

Oh yeah.

Shaun:

Well, you've mentioned the CP world conference on Saturday and the UK in

Shaun:

London, which will be a great event.

Shaun:

Unfortunately, I'm not going to be able to attend, but we also have the

Shaun:

workplace violence event from the Circuit magazine, which is on the 19th.

Shaun:

Yes.

Shaun:

So I'm very much looking forward to that and the different guest speakers.

Shaun:

Maybe you can tell us

Phelim:

a bit about that.

Phelim:

Absolutely.

Phelim:

So we're going to go, uh, and, and, and add, you know, soft power, uh, speakers

Phelim:

and hard power speakers, people that touch, um, you know, the raw emotions

Phelim:

that, you know, workplace violence creates and, and, and is inspired by.

Phelim:

But for example, Our friend, Joe Saunders, uh, is coming back to talk

Phelim:

about managing workplace violence.

Phelim:

Obviously we, we, we, we like, uh, his work and the managing workplace

Phelim:

violence, you know, uh, podcast as well.

Phelim:

So it's really going to be a quite accessible forum.

Phelim:

It's going to be in the UK often evening the U S afternoon, and then

Phelim:

the Australian early morning, but not so early, that it's impossible.

Phelim:

So it's going to be great for the community and talking about the community.

Phelim:

I don't know if we saw, but, uh, the BBA amp, uh, had some lively debates.

Phelim:

Didn't it?

Phelim:

On last week's podcast, topic of robotics?

Phelim:

Um, I was, I was suggesting that may be robotics, could help relieve mundane,

Phelim:

repetitive tasks from EAP colleagues.

Phelim:

Um, but, uh, but it was good to see the debate, wasn't it.

Phelim:

Sure.

Shaun:

But I think.

Shaun:

The term robotics, maybe slightly misconstrued.

Shaun:

Um, I think some people may think, are you suggesting robotic robots will replace

Shaun:

an EAP operator or some function there of where I think if you're talking about

Shaun:

technology, um, and games and technology, for sure, you know, technology can

Shaun:

be harnessed in many different ways.

Shaun:

It can be a force multiplier and it come take away.

Shaun:

Some of them mundane tasks.

Shaun:

Easier and, you know, maybe more efficient.

Shaun:

Um, so you should definitely look, you know, keep an eye, keep

Shaun:

abreast of the latest technology.

Shaun:

Um, but yeah, no, it was, it was an interesting debate.

Phelim:

And then we heartily encouraged the same debate after today's

Phelim:

podcast on protecting mobility.

Phelim:

Um, maybe there are strong views on, uh, self-driving cars.

Phelim:

Maybe there's some strong views on, uh, you know, uh, immobilizes and,

Phelim:

and, and things that we've touched on also with Joe or Tara before, um,

Phelim:

in our protection mobility forum.

Phelim:

So please keep those comments coming.

Phelim:

We need the debate because of course we are shining one light

Phelim:

in one area of our community.

Phelim:

There are many other leading lights and we are very keen to hear from you.

Phelim:

So please like share and subscribe and, you know, maybe think of one person that

Phelim:

does not yet know about the podcast and get them to have a listen and perhaps,

Phelim:

uh, engaged to grow the community.

Phelim:

Uh, that would be a fantastic thing.

Phelim:

If you could do that just for.

Phelim:

From Sean and myself, this has been another fantastic edition

Phelim:

of the circuit magazine podcasts.

Intro:

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Neil Davies OBE:

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Neil Davies OBE:

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The Circuit Magazine Podcast
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